Curse

gremlin · May 05, 2009, 09:59 PM // 21:59

Never understood the written expletive, outside of literature or when designed to shock such as a newspaper article.

If I do something stupid I may let rip a verbal curse or whatever but that is an instant reaction to a given situation.

By the time I would have typed it the moment is passed and there isn't any point, besides its more a comment to myself anyone who hears it does so by accident

But typing it thats an unknown so far as I am concerned probably just trying to fit in with the crowd and appear cool when really your not.

Ok maybe an sh etc I died but thats about all.

*Darcy* · May 05, 2009, 09:59 PM // 21:59

Although most 13-year-olds swear more than adults, if ANet doesn't enforce the 13+ rating requirements then they lose part of their target markets.

Most 13-year-olds don't go out and buy the game themselves. They get it from a parent-purchase or as a gift from some other adult. These are the people who pay attention to the ratings.

You are free to speak as you like in-game or on-forum. But then be prepared to take your punishment without complaint. This is why we make fun of these threads. You knowingly break a rule and then come here and whine about your ban.

Fril Estelin · May 05, 2009, 10:05 PM // 22:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inde

Way to go Fril, you turned it intellectual.

The ultimate swearword on the Internet. My reputation is ruined on Guru. So I may as well go all the way...

I discovered very quickly when seriously trying to improve my English (listening to the Xfiles without subtitles

) that humour is the most difficult aspect of a language. Sarcasm is one of its most confusing expression, where you use ambiguity to the extent of making your text not understandable to the one not tuned to your tone.

No joke.

Mr. G · May 05, 2009, 10:11 PM // 22:11

Quote:

(listening to the Xfiles without subtitles )

One of the worlds finest educational facilities

If its any compensations your more articulate than me.

Rocky Raccoon · May 05, 2009, 10:19 PM // 22:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inde

Way to go Fril, you turned it intellectual. IS NOTHING SACRED?!

Obscenities only are allowed and the usual tired arguments of:

Use common sense/grow a bigger vocabulary/learn some self control

and the counter

This is a teen game/all kids have heard worse/lighten up/if you don't want to hear it leave

I am way past my teens, I know all the words and use them, but I also know when they are not appropriate. Knowing the words is one thing, knowing the situation where to use them is another. Fril, your English is much better than some of the English speaking people who post on this forum, and your point should be well taken by others.

HawkofStorms · May 05, 2009, 10:24 PM // 22:24

It's actually a worse violation of the rules to deliberately bypass the dirty word filter.
a) because you know it is bad and would be censored and are trying to get around it
b) because anybody who does have the censorship software turned on will see it (so parents who try to keep that language away from their children can't if you say something that would be blocked, but spell it weirdly).

lewis91 · May 05, 2009, 10:40 PM // 22:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by HawkofStorms

It's actually a worse violation of the rules to deliberately bypass the dirty word filter.
a) because you know it is bad and would be censored and are trying to get around it
b) because anybody who does have the censorship software turned on will see it (so parents who try to keep that language away from their children can't if you say something that would be blocked, but spell it weirdly).

Thats actually the most true thing said in this thread so far, i vote /win for this fella. Thats exactly why someone would say "FxCK" or something like that. But you still get those idiots who have the filter turned off, that complain when you do actually use a "swear" word. Best thing is not to be stupid and overuse such words, who needs to spam every "bad" word you can think of in chat?

Lonesamurai · May 05, 2009, 10:52 PM // 22:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fril Estelin

The ultimate swearword on the Internet. My reputation is ruined on Guru.

You had a reputation?

A11Eur0 · May 05, 2009, 10:57 PM // 22:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fril Estelin

Except these swearwords: these words are mostly used in a derogatory manner, to insult people or strengthen insults, to express strong and negative emotions, to push people away, etc. Of course you actually don't need these words to do that, but can you find a positive use of these words? Some may argue that they have an emotional nature that should not be remove, but then I'd suggest to go out and do some serious sport instead of using words to convey such strong emotions. I'm not a word nazi, I think that it is a better strategy

.

One can claim, sitting on the chair of its high principles of "freedom of speech", that people should simply close their ears or turn their chat filters on, but this is a deep misunderstanding of the issue. (apart from the problem of wanting absolute freedom without accepting the consequences of one's word) People will always abuse language, whatever safeguards you put in place. Bypassing a chat filter often become a game (hello 4chan), at the expense of those that actually speak normally.

In this kind of discussion, people will often mention that one has to be "fragile" to not accept swearwords, in whatever form they're found. It may well be true, but this shows not only how insensitive those that think they're not fragile are, it also shows how much social progress our societies must achieve to become trully "civilised", in the sense of not letting the "law of the strongest" blind us from deeper truth.

(re-reading myself, I realise that I haven't expressed myself in the clearest way possible, but my time and command of the English language only allows me to do that)

"I'ma go take a shit."
"Careful, don't step in that dog shit"
"don't sit there, you'll get paint all over your ass"
and my personal favorite:

"Hi, Wanna F***?"

None of these are inherently negative. The only negativity they bring is the arbitrary socially-dictated negative connotations of these words as "dirty".

I'd be more inclined to be offended by someone saying "You're a fag" than someone saying "let's get the F*** out of here." But which one is censored, and which isn't?

People who take such offense at words used, especially not to project negativity onto them but merely to punctuate emotion, are indeed fragile. Also, limiting vocabulary by outlawing and arbitrarily shunning specific words that you do not agree with merely for the sake of that society becoming more "civilized" is a step towards totalitarianism. Censorship has always been a tool of tyrants. Doing away with basic gutteral emotions through language manipulation is the forefront of any push towards mob control.

Fril Estelin · May 05, 2009, 11:22 PM // 23:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by A11Eur0

merely to punctuate emotion, are indeed fragile.

One can say that the one "punctuating emotions" with these words has no empathy, or sensitivity. A lot of the greatest minds were fragile, for a very good reason.

Quote:

Also, limiting vocabulary by outlawing and arbitrarily shunning specific words that you do not agree with merely for the sake of that society becoming more "civilized" is a step towards totalitarianism.

And not doing it is a step towards anarchy. (this is as much an exaggeration as your statement) Which one is best?

-Sonata- · May 05, 2009, 11:27 PM // 23:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by A11Eur0

Censorship has always been a tool of tyrants. Doing away with basic gutteral emotions through language manipulation is the forefront of any push towards mob control.

And those who seek to say and do whatever they please, without consequence on action, the anarchist; Also seek their own definition of absolute power. Neither one is better than the other. Both bang heads for the same goal: Control.

I've said many times before I swear like a sailor in my personal life. It doesn't offend me to hear it. However, there is a time and place for it. This game isn't your free for all to say and do as you please.

Verene · May 05, 2009, 11:45 PM // 23:45

Quote:

(listening to the Xfiles without subtitles )

I highly approve of your method to improve your English

Go X-Files!

Anyway. There are rules on what sort of language is allowed in the game and what isn't. There are filters in place. These filters don't make using stuff that'd normally be blocked out by them acceptable because "people won't see it". You see "----" in the chat, and you know that someone is using vulgar language that they shouldn't be, even if you don't know specifically what word they are using.

And then stuff like "shxt" and "fxck"...you are deliberately bypassing the censors in place. The people who have the filters on, because they either don't feel like seeing such language or because their parents think it's not appropriate, ARE seeing what you're saying, because the filter doesn't catch that. Frankly, that's even worse, in my opinion.

There's a time and place. Are people so lax with basic manners and common courtesies that they've forgotten that it's always been considered rude to use profanities in front of others? Just because you may not find it offensive does not mean that everyone else won't as well.

I'm an adult, and I swear, yes. However, I've also grown up enough to realize that there are times that such language is just plain not acceptable. I don't swear in class, I don't swear at work, I don't swear around people who I don't know well, and I don't swear in a game where I know there're kids playing. It's just, really, that's common sense and basic etiquette. I play GW with the chat filter off, and sometimes what I see in the local chat is appalling. Spamming every profanity you can think of in Kamadan AD1 local doesn't make you look cool. It just makes you look crass, tacky, and incredibly rude and not caring at all for anyone else who may be around.

Kumu Honua · May 06, 2009, 01:06 AM // 01:06

Those who get reported are those who are being offensive on purpose. Usually the words are directed at someone. Someone who will retaliate by reporting the violation and causing you to get banned eventually.

Just typing something like "Aww shit, forgot to get the quest for Rragars Menagerie, we have to go back so we can get past the door..." will not get you a report most times.

It's those who use the words DIRECTLY in an effort to be offensive that get reported and banned. I'm not saying the above wouldn't be reported, just that the chance is FAR lower because you aren't pissing someone off directly. Which is what most expletives are used in the game as far as I have seen.

I support these bans.

Zahr Dalsk · May 06, 2009, 02:06 AM // 02:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagmaRed

In most places it is illegal to walk around nude.

In most places it is legal to use any sort of language you wish.

glacialphoenix · May 06, 2009, 02:16 AM // 02:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Verene

And then stuff like "shxt" and "fxck"...you are deliberately bypassing the censors in place. The people who have the filters on, because they either don't feel like seeing such language or because their parents think it's not appropriate, ARE seeing what you're saying, because the filter doesn't catch that. Frankly, that's even worse, in my opinion.

I agree with this. If you leave your chat filter off, however, and see someone swearing in chat... well, unless it's verbal abuse, I don't see why you're complaining.

Quote:

I'd be more inclined to be offended by someone saying "You're a fag" than someone saying "let's get the F*** out of here." But which one is censored, and which isn't?

I do believe that the first one would fall under 'verbal abuse'. Which is reportable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fril Estelin

I discovered very quickly when seriously trying to improve my English (listening to the Xfiles without subtitles ) that humour is the most difficult aspect of a language. Sarcasm is one of its most confusing expression, where you use ambiguity to the extent of making your text not understandable to the one not tuned to your tone.

Yeah, it is. Don't worry, Fril - as far as communicating on this thread goes, you're perfectly understandable.

HawkofStorms · May 06, 2009, 02:23 AM // 02:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk

In most places it is legal to use any sort of language you wish.

Not true. I can't threaten your life. There are limits to what people can say. Now, you can argue all you want about whether or not that's morally right, but you can't deny that that occurs.
There are, and always have been, restrictions on free speech in order to protect the public welfare.

Now, I'm REALLY tired of having the same conversation with the same four people on guru whenever the naming/censorship policy comes up. Good night.

haggus71 · May 06, 2009, 02:27 AM // 02:27

Spending 9 years in the Navy, I think I'm a bit more of an expert in this category, and have forgotten more vulgar and straight insane expressions of various anatomy than you all, combined, can remember.

The only thing that matters is this: if you say a word, you won't get banned. If you slander, attack or harass someone, or try to get by a system set up to allow others to play the game without seeing certain language, you will get banned.

As to free speech...THEY OWN THE SERVERS! It's in their interest to keep them running by keeping the most clientelle they can happy. You just paid for the privilege of using this server space to play their game. After agreeing to an EULA that stated you could be banned for any of a number of reasons. If you want to act like an ass outside of a game, go ahead. You can say "RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO-ass-cockgobbling-cumgurgler" all you want anywhere else. I knew kids in a camp I worked at that used to edit the vowels out of cuss words, thinking they were getting by the rules. It didn't work with them, and it won't work on GW. Doing such, in fact, proves your lack of maturity.

As for "steps toward communism/fascism/(add your own -ism)", you have no clue, none, what it's like to live in such a world. There are some who play the game who have family in N. Korea, China, or were behind the curtain in the "good ole days" of the Cold War, who could fill you in. That is the type of thing said by a child raised like a veal, who has no inkling of reality beyond American Idol and High School Musical 43.

/rant. I gotta stop reading threads like these.

edit: Wow! I didn't know the filter wouldn't stop those words! Sorry Inde

pumpkin pie · May 06, 2009, 03:35 AM // 03:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fril Estelin

(listening to the Xfiles without subtitles

Watching Cartoons as a child and never missing one single episode helps too

to OP:

Think of it this way, at a plaza, public meeting place, public transports anything that you have to share with other humans, do you not get disgusted if you sat on a bus seat and found later on, a piece of chewing gum had stuck on your hair because someone inconsiderate had left it there? or public toilets, person before you did not take the trouble to flush? I am sure some of these thing make you tick. Swearing in a public place is just like that. The point is, when in a Shared environment, you should consider that there are other humans around, we are there together, and should respect the shared environment, your expectation that other people should tolerate your ways of using your vocabulary should apply on yourself too, which is: tolerate those that cannot tolerate your way.

my 2 cents

Inde · May 06, 2009, 03:38 AM // 03:38

Yeah haggus71, we have a very loose filter here on Guru. And yet we still get some who complain. (I'm not talking to you IRC PEOPLE... you know who you are... go away!)

A11Eur0 · May 06, 2009, 03:43 AM // 03:43

it's a plain and simple thing: the chat filter is there for a reason. GW already covered their asses by putting the disclaimer on the box and implementing the chat filter. people who actively turn off their filters then whinge about seeing all the naughty language need to be slapped with a ripened tuna fish sandwich. Those who bypass the filters deserve the reports and the bans. Those of us who drop the occasional F-bomb to make a point ( I don't toss it around liberally as some do), without bypassing the filter, should be more than covered by the filter an disclaimer and immune from any further action. It should be that simple.